WEBVTT

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Speaker A: The following podcast is part of the.

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Valerie Milburn: MindBodySpirit FM podcast network.

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Speaker A: This episode is brought to you by State Farm.

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Valerie Milburn: There.

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Helen Sneed: At Sierra Discover Top workout gear at

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Speaker A: Awkward.

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Speaker A: Sierra let's get moving.

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Helen Sneed: Welcome to our award winning podcast,

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Mental Health, Hope and Recovery.

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I'm Helen Sneed.

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Valerie Milburn: And I'm Valerie Milburn.

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Helen Sneed: We both have fought and overcome

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severe chronic mental illnesses.

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Our podcast offers a unique approach to

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mental health conditions. We use practical

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skills and inspirational true stories of

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recovery. Our knowledge is up close and

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and personal.

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Valerie Milburn: Helen and I are your peers. We're not

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doctors, therapists or social workers. We're

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not professionals, but we are experts.

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We are experts in our own lived experience

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with multiple mental health diagnoses and

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symptoms. Please join us on our

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journey.

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Helen Sneed: We live in recovery, so can you.

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Valerie Milburn: This podcast does not provide medical advice.

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The information presented is not intended to

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be a substitute for or relied upon as

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medical advice, diagnosis or treatment.

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The podcast is for informational purposes

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only. Always seek the advice of your

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physician or other qualified health providers

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with any health related questions you may

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have.

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Helen Sneed: Welcome to episode 52,

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the Family Dynamics of a Psychiatric Crisis

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Part 5 the Family Therapist

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A Professional Perspective

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Today marks the fifth and final episode of

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our series, the Family Dynamics of a

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Psychiatric Crisis. Valerie and I

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encourage you to visit the first four

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episodes where we made an in depth

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exploration of the many challenges and

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numerous roles in a family

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where a member has mental health issues.

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Now throughout the series we've had spouses,

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siblings, parents, children, caregivers,

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people with mental health conditions, all

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providing their point of view in response to

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our probing questions. Now, our

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overall goal has been to define

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and demystify the impact of mental illness on

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the family and to enlighten and

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strengthen the impact of the family on mental

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illness.

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Valerie Milburn: Now today will be an episode filled with

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invaluable professional advice as we talk

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with our guest, Lisa Powell Watts,

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a seasoned psychotherapist of 40

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years. It's my great pleasure to tell

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you something of her distinguished career.

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Lisa received her Master's degree in

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education with a focus on counseling and

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guidance from Texas State University in

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1984. Since then, she has received

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her professional counselor license, her

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marriage and family therapist license, and

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her chemical dependency counselor license.

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It's Lisa's extensive experience

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in family counseling that we will

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particularly call on today.

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For these past 40 years, Lisa has been a

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practicing psychotherapist in both inpatient

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and outpatient settings. Over the years, she

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has seen individuals, couples and

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families in counseling and has also led

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numerous trainings. Lisa met and

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trained with Dr. Brenda Davies,

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British psychiatrist and author, over

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25 years ago. With Dr. Davies, she

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began utilizing mind body approaches to

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healing with her clients. From

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2008 to 2018, she had a healing

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school in which she taught other helping

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professionals these mind body healing

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techniques. Now, I can personally

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attest that Lisa is gifted in the

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technique of chakra healing. Lisa

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is a healer. In 2019,

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she wrote a wonderful book, Chakra

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Healing A New Path forward in treating

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Addictions and Other Issues. It was a very

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helpful book for me. Today,

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Lisa is semi retired and mainly offers

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phone sessions to her clients. Her contact

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information will be in our show notes so that

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you can contact Lisa with any questions you

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may have. Now I have to share this.

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Lisa is not only a Dear Friend of

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45 years, she is an emotional

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rock for me and with our friend Kelly.

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Lisa is the third side of a triangle that

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makes up one of the most meaningful

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relationships in my life.

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Lisa, thank you for being with us

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today.

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Speaker A: Thank you for having me. I'm. I'm really

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excited about sharing what I know about

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family therapy and just feel so honored

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to get to be a part of this.

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Valerie Milburn: Well, we're happy you're here and let's just

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jump right in. Well, what drew

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you to a family practice?

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Speaker A: Well, I had started working on my

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master's degree in counseling and there

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was, this was back in the 80s and

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we had, my class had the opportunity

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to see Dr. Virginia Satir

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and she was one of the pioneers in family

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therapy. And so when I saw her,

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it was, it was just one of those magical

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moments. Her whole approach

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was about building the nurturing

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family, how to build a nurturing family.

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And I was just hooked after I saw

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Virginia Satir. And it wasn't long

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after that that people like John

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Bradshaw, Pia Melody,

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those therapists and

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authors were talking about the

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roles and the rules of addicted

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families. And I came from alcoholic family.

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So I really, really

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resonated with what they said about the roles

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in those families and how they get

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affected by the members alcoholism

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or addiction. So I've just always

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integrated Trying to get in as many members

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of the family as I can when I'm working

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with an individual.

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Helen Sneed: Well, I think we want to hear more about that

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as our conversation goes on. But

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I'm going to start with a quote that I'm sure

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you've heard, but that is one of my

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favorites. And it's from Leo

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Tolstoy. He said, all

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happy families are alike.

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Each unhappy family is unhappy

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in its own way. Now

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we are wrapping up a five part series

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on family dynamics when there is a

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psychiatric crisis. As I said earlier,

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Lisa, if you could pinpoint a couple of

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things that are imperative to healthy

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family dynamics during such times,

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what would they be?

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Speaker A: Okay, there's so many

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parts to this, but the two main ones I would

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say is for the

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family members to have open communication

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to talk about it. It's just so important.

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So many times family members will

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isolate. And we were, I've heard

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y' all talk about the stigma with men, with

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men, addiction. And it just kills me that

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it's still prevalent in some areas. But it

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is. And so a lot of times family members will

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not reach out to other people or talk

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to each other about it. I think they feel so

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helpless in making a change

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with the person that is struggling with a

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mental illness. The open communication,

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the talking to each other. And then the

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second thing I would say is reaching out for

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help.

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Valerie Milburn: Yes.

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Speaker A: You know, reading all that you can about it,

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finding some professionals that you feel

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comfortable with seeing, those are probably

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the two most important things. The

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communication, the talking to each other and

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finding some good help and support.

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Valerie Milburn: I'm so glad to hear you say that because we,

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you know, Helen and I really hammer on

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that, that isolation is so deadly and

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that education and help are just imperative.

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So, so glad those are things that

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you find important as well. And

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in the role of families. We have a question

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that I, you know, Helen and I have kicked

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this around too. Have you found that the

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family dynamic inevitably,

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inevitably plays a definitive

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role in a family member developing a mental

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health.

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Speaker A: Well, yes and no. I mean, because there

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are some mental health disorders that

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are genetic and

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neurotransmitted or affect.

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The neurotransmitters are affected.

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Valerie Milburn: Right. So this is kind of also the nature

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versus.

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Speaker A: Okay, yes, absolutely.

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So the family, maybe there aren't

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dynamics in the family that cause

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the mental health disturbance, but the family

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still needs help in learning how to deal with

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it. Absolutely.

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Sometimes, you know, and sometimes there are

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disorders that a lot of times that skip

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a generation. So if, if a child,

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a teenager maybe develops A thought

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disorder, you know, one of the forms of

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schizophrenia. Well, if mom or dad

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don't relate, cannot relate to that, because

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neither one had a thought disorder. One

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of them may remember that one of their

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parents did or an uncle did. It just skipped

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a generation. Addiction does that a lot. You

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know, it will. Maybe mom or dad don't become

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addicted, but maybe a grandparent had it and

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it skipped a generation, and then one of the

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children inherits that genetic

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component. So it's

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funny, it's interesting, because sometimes

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families will want to spend a lot of time in

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trying to figure out. Sometimes it's about

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to put blame on where these disorders

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come from. So it's. It's interesting and

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we'll talk about that. But really, the thing

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that is most salient is, is how to treat

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it and how to support everybody in the. In

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the family.

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Helen Sneed: Yeah, that's a tall order, I think. I do

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remember, as, you know, far better than we

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do.

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Valerie Milburn: Yeah. I do remember once my mom saying, I

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wonder where you got this. Yeah. Like, oh,

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I'm not going there with you.

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Helen Sneed: But, yeah, because. Well, this. This really

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does lead to the next question, which is,

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Lisa, as you know, in many therapeutic

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approaches over many, many years,

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the family is blamed for making the person

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sick. Now, what has your own experience

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taught you, and can you promote

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understanding rather than blame? Is that

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possible?

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Speaker A: Absolutely. You know, sometimes

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I felt like a detective,

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a kind detective, kind, caring detective

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with the family because I want to

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understand, and I don't want to judge,

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and I am not the expert

270
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on their family. They are. And so I ask

271
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questions for them to teach me about their

272
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family. And. And it's kind

273
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of like we're in this together.

274
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And so I try to join with the family by not

275
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judging them and not

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acting like I think I know more than them,

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because I really don't. They're teaching me.

278
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So I hope that I'm modeling,

279
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Promoting understanding as opposed to

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blaming them. You know, it's. You know, when

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Valerie was saying while ago, when her mother

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was saying, wonder where you got this? You

283
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know, I notice with families

284
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and with individuals, too, you can ask

285
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a question that will shut them down and you

286
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won't get any further. So you don't want to

287
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blame. You don't want to be

288
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judgmental. You. I'm always saying

289
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with the families, I see the thing

290
00:12:57.950 --> 00:13:00.550
that I start off with a lot is I wonder,

291
00:13:00.950 --> 00:13:03.870
you know, I'm wondering if. Blah, blah, blah.

292
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And I ask a question because I don't know.

293
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And I want them to help me understand

294
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I don't want to go in, like, I think I'm the

295
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expert because I'll lose them every time.

296
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Yeah. And I want to keep them engaged. I want

297
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to, and I do want to understand them.

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Valerie Milburn: Well, that's the communication that

299
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you're very good at. And you would want to go

300
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back to what. I want to go back to what you

301
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said earlier about communication being, you

302
00:13:29.850 --> 00:13:31.810
know, the foundation of

303
00:13:32.530 --> 00:13:35.490
helping your family member heal. And so how

304
00:13:35.490 --> 00:13:37.690
do you counsel a family with communication

305
00:13:37.690 --> 00:13:40.130
issues and poor communication skills? Can

306
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they learn a common language?

307
00:13:42.450 --> 00:13:44.969
Speaker A: Absolutely. Absolutely they can. And you

308
00:13:44.969 --> 00:13:47.530
know, communication is not something that

309
00:13:47.530 --> 00:13:50.410
we're taught a lot of times, so we don't

310
00:13:50.410 --> 00:13:53.090
know how to do it well. And so I hope that I

311
00:13:53.730 --> 00:13:56.490
model that for them. All I

312
00:13:56.490 --> 00:13:59.410
know is it was very helpful in my

313
00:13:59.410 --> 00:14:02.170
graduate program to learn active listening.

314
00:14:03.370 --> 00:14:06.250
So when they are talking, the first thing

315
00:14:06.410 --> 00:14:09.050
that I'm thinking is not how I'm going to

316
00:14:09.050 --> 00:14:11.930
respond. I want to elicit more

317
00:14:11.930 --> 00:14:14.410
information from them. You know,

318
00:14:14.650 --> 00:14:17.130
I'm into what they're saying. And like I

319
00:14:17.130 --> 00:14:19.050
said, I'm kind of a detective. I feel like a

320
00:14:19.050 --> 00:14:21.170
detective. So I've got some questions I want

321
00:14:21.170 --> 00:14:23.930
them to explain. The most important

322
00:14:23.930 --> 00:14:26.860
thing at that moment to me is what they're

323
00:14:26.860 --> 00:14:29.060
saying to me. Not what I have to respond to,

324
00:14:29.220 --> 00:14:31.700
to them, but what they're saying to me.

325
00:14:31.860 --> 00:14:34.660
So I hope I model active

326
00:14:34.660 --> 00:14:37.540
listening and staying with them. And

327
00:14:37.700 --> 00:14:40.700
you know, sometimes in the beginning with a

328
00:14:40.700 --> 00:14:43.220
high conflict family, you have to

329
00:14:44.180 --> 00:14:46.420
kind of lay out rules. No,

330
00:14:47.060 --> 00:14:50.060
try not to interrupt. No,

331
00:14:50.060 --> 00:14:52.680
no yelling. Keeping it calm

332
00:14:52.840 --> 00:14:55.760
in the, in the session. And you know, most

333
00:14:55.760 --> 00:14:57.600
of the times they can do that. Sometimes

334
00:14:57.600 --> 00:15:00.280
things get heated and, and when,

335
00:15:00.760 --> 00:15:02.640
when the energy picks up like that and it

336
00:15:02.640 --> 00:15:05.080
gets heated, I get very calm.

337
00:15:05.400 --> 00:15:07.080
I get very calm.

338
00:15:08.280 --> 00:15:11.000
I learned that someone has to be, someone

339
00:15:11.000 --> 00:15:13.920
has to be to bring the energy down, to

340
00:15:13.920 --> 00:15:15.520
bring the reactivity down a little.

341
00:15:15.520 --> 00:15:17.650
Helen Sneed: Yeah. Well, this

342
00:15:18.930 --> 00:15:21.410
kind of leads to my next question, which is

343
00:15:22.290 --> 00:15:24.090
boundaries, which we all know are so

344
00:15:24.090 --> 00:15:26.210
important in all kinds of relationships. But

345
00:15:26.210 --> 00:15:29.170
for families, are there boundaries you

346
00:15:29.170 --> 00:15:31.810
recommend for family members to maintain

347
00:15:32.290 --> 00:15:35.170
for their own well being while supporting

348
00:15:35.170 --> 00:15:36.050
their loved one?

349
00:15:36.530 --> 00:15:39.410
Speaker A: Oh, absolutely. And Helen, that's so

350
00:15:39.490 --> 00:15:42.210
true. Boundaries are so

351
00:15:42.290 --> 00:15:43.490
super, super important.

352
00:15:45.420 --> 00:15:47.140
That's one of the things that we'll talk

353
00:15:47.140 --> 00:15:49.420
about as I'm working with a family.

354
00:15:49.980 --> 00:15:51.860
And boundaries are important, whether there's

355
00:15:51.860 --> 00:15:54.700
been a huge psychiatric crisis or just in

356
00:15:54.700 --> 00:15:57.380
regular family therapy, in

357
00:15:57.380 --> 00:15:59.820
that the individual

358
00:16:00.859 --> 00:16:03.180
self care of each of the members is very,

359
00:16:03.180 --> 00:16:05.980
very important. And I try to teach them.

360
00:16:06.380 --> 00:16:08.300
You know, what I'm learning now about

361
00:16:09.100 --> 00:16:11.990
what we feel in our bodies, we can

362
00:16:11.990 --> 00:16:14.030
feel in our bodies when somebody has

363
00:16:14.030 --> 00:16:16.430
transgressed our boundaries and

364
00:16:16.830 --> 00:16:19.150
when they feel, I try to teach them, when

365
00:16:19.150 --> 00:16:21.270
they feel that that's the time to say

366
00:16:21.270 --> 00:16:23.150
something and say something very kind.

367
00:16:23.390 --> 00:16:26.310
Because a lot of times boundaries are stepped

368
00:16:26.310 --> 00:16:28.710
over and the person doing the stepping over

369
00:16:28.710 --> 00:16:31.110
didn't realize they did that. So they kind of

370
00:16:31.110 --> 00:16:33.470
need to be educated, you know that.

371
00:16:34.590 --> 00:16:37.310
I don't want to talk about an example, I

372
00:16:37.310 --> 00:16:39.310
don't want to talk about that right now. Or

373
00:16:41.230 --> 00:16:44.220
let's revisit that another time. Or

374
00:16:44.540 --> 00:16:47.020
if you're being asked to do something

375
00:16:47.740 --> 00:16:50.660
over what you feel comfortable doing, that

376
00:16:50.660 --> 00:16:53.660
you say, no, I don't feel comfortable doing

377
00:16:53.660 --> 00:16:56.500
that. But that it takes really good self

378
00:16:56.500 --> 00:16:58.780
knowledge and being in touch with your body

379
00:16:59.500 --> 00:17:02.260
to know if you can do that or not. Now if you

380
00:17:02.260 --> 00:17:04.700
say yes and you do something against your

381
00:17:04.700 --> 00:17:07.420
boundaries, that feels awful. It

382
00:17:07.420 --> 00:17:10.320
feels awful. So you need to, you

383
00:17:10.320 --> 00:17:11.160
know, honor that.

384
00:17:11.800 --> 00:17:14.240
Valerie Milburn: Yeah, I had to learn to do that. And I

385
00:17:14.240 --> 00:17:17.200
finally learned that I can say this is

386
00:17:17.200 --> 00:17:19.960
a lot. I need to process this. I

387
00:17:19.960 --> 00:17:22.680
promise to get back with you, but you know,

388
00:17:22.840 --> 00:17:24.800
and usually at this point I'm crying, but I

389
00:17:24.800 --> 00:17:27.800
can say I cannot talk about this right

390
00:17:27.800 --> 00:17:30.760
now. And I, but I do say, you

391
00:17:30.760 --> 00:17:33.720
know, I need to process this and I promise I

392
00:17:33.720 --> 00:17:35.880
will get back with you, but not right now.

393
00:17:35.960 --> 00:17:38.760
Speaker A: Oh, that's perfect. That, that is perfect.

394
00:17:38.840 --> 00:17:40.840
And one other thing I'd like to say.

395
00:17:42.820 --> 00:17:44.420
There's something that we talk about in

396
00:17:44.420 --> 00:17:46.100
family therapy about rescuing.

397
00:17:47.220 --> 00:17:49.340
It's never a good thing. It is not a good

398
00:17:49.340 --> 00:17:51.780
thing. So if we go against our

399
00:17:51.780 --> 00:17:54.340
boundaries and we say,

400
00:17:54.580 --> 00:17:56.820
you know, we think, okay, they really need

401
00:17:56.820 --> 00:17:58.780
this, they're asking me to do this and I

402
00:17:58.780 --> 00:18:00.660
don't feel comfortable, but they really need

403
00:18:00.660 --> 00:18:02.500
me. I mean, you know, what are they going to

404
00:18:02.500 --> 00:18:04.620
do if I don't do this? If I don't, you know,

405
00:18:04.620 --> 00:18:07.500
bail them out or whatever, again, that's not

406
00:18:07.500 --> 00:18:09.940
good. I mean, it's an insult

407
00:18:10.470 --> 00:18:12.310
to continually rescue

408
00:18:13.350 --> 00:18:15.750
family members because you're really kind of

409
00:18:15.750 --> 00:18:18.070
telling them you don't really have the

410
00:18:18.070 --> 00:18:20.870
ability to get out of this scrape. But I

411
00:18:20.870 --> 00:18:23.270
do. You know, it's a one up situation or

412
00:18:23.270 --> 00:18:25.630
that's the thinking. I think, you know, I

413
00:18:25.630 --> 00:18:28.310
will rush in and rescue you and

414
00:18:28.710 --> 00:18:31.110
it's usually an insult. That's not a good

415
00:18:31.110 --> 00:18:31.430
thing.

416
00:18:31.590 --> 00:18:33.750
Helen Sneed: The rest, it also seems like you would learn

417
00:18:33.750 --> 00:18:35.830
so much more by

418
00:18:36.150 --> 00:18:38.830
watching how they naturally communicate with

419
00:18:38.830 --> 00:18:41.180
each other rather than rescuing them.

420
00:18:41.260 --> 00:18:41.620
Valerie Milburn: Yes.

421
00:18:41.620 --> 00:18:43.140
Helen Sneed: You know what I mean? Because that to me

422
00:18:43.140 --> 00:18:45.140
would be where you, you would learn so Much

423
00:18:45.140 --> 00:18:45.900
about the family?

424
00:18:46.460 --> 00:18:49.100
Speaker A: Yes. Oh, I. I'm telling you, those

425
00:18:49.100 --> 00:18:51.820
sessions are so instructive.

426
00:18:52.140 --> 00:18:55.020
I mean, you know, it for a while, I am

427
00:18:55.020 --> 00:18:57.940
just watching because it. The way

428
00:18:57.940 --> 00:19:00.260
they interact with each other, you know,

429
00:19:00.260 --> 00:19:03.060
who's in control. Sometimes people are in

430
00:19:03.060 --> 00:19:05.900
control in a strong, you know, an

431
00:19:05.900 --> 00:19:08.180
overpowering way. And sometimes there will be

432
00:19:08.180 --> 00:19:10.740
a family member that controls by silence, by

433
00:19:10.740 --> 00:19:13.600
not saying, you know. And if you want the

434
00:19:13.600 --> 00:19:15.440
truth of what's going on in a family, you

435
00:19:15.440 --> 00:19:17.440
bring in the teenagers because they're the

436
00:19:17.440 --> 00:19:19.240
truth tellers. You know,

437
00:19:20.360 --> 00:19:22.200
I think it's interesting, too,

438
00:19:23.160 --> 00:19:25.880
the other thing I've learned about kind of

439
00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:28.800
these invisible cords or connections

440
00:19:28.800 --> 00:19:31.520
that family members have. You know, a lot of

441
00:19:31.520 --> 00:19:33.600
times family members, parents will try to

442
00:19:33.600 --> 00:19:36.280
protect kids, say there's an affair going on.

443
00:19:36.280 --> 00:19:38.250
They'll say the kids don't know about it, and

444
00:19:38.250 --> 00:19:40.490
they'll try to protect kids. The kids always

445
00:19:40.490 --> 00:19:42.490
know something's going on. They may not know

446
00:19:42.490 --> 00:19:45.050
exactly what, but they know something is

447
00:19:45.050 --> 00:19:47.890
going on. So learning how to be honest

448
00:19:49.170 --> 00:19:51.930
in a developmentally correct way with what

449
00:19:51.930 --> 00:19:53.650
they can handle is really important.

450
00:19:55.410 --> 00:19:58.210
Valerie Milburn: My kids said I communicated a lot in

451
00:19:58.210 --> 00:20:01.090
silence. And they called it the power of the

452
00:20:01.090 --> 00:20:02.290
raised eyebrow.

453
00:20:05.420 --> 00:20:05.660
Helen Sneed: Right.

454
00:20:06.620 --> 00:20:08.620
Speaker A: Oh, gosh, yeah.

455
00:20:10.060 --> 00:20:12.620
Valerie Milburn: So by all the

456
00:20:12.620 --> 00:20:15.420
watching and calmness and learning,

457
00:20:15.660 --> 00:20:18.300
what helps you determine that real

458
00:20:18.380 --> 00:20:21.380
progress is being made within the family? Are

459
00:20:21.380 --> 00:20:23.180
there signposts along the way?

460
00:20:23.900 --> 00:20:26.620
Speaker A: Yes, absolutely.

461
00:20:27.580 --> 00:20:29.900
Usually they're. They're good about coming to

462
00:20:29.900 --> 00:20:31.220
all their appointments. They're taking

463
00:20:31.220 --> 00:20:33.930
advantage of all the help, so they'll come to

464
00:20:33.930 --> 00:20:35.970
their appointments and they come in and they

465
00:20:35.970 --> 00:20:38.010
work. You know, it's in the beginning,

466
00:20:38.090 --> 00:20:40.970
sometimes there's a lot of work on my part.

467
00:20:41.050 --> 00:20:43.010
You know, you're establishing boundaries in

468
00:20:43.010 --> 00:20:46.010
the. In the session, you know, being

469
00:20:46.010 --> 00:20:48.290
on time, paying your bill, you know, all that

470
00:20:48.290 --> 00:20:51.290
kind of stuff. But after a while,

471
00:20:51.290 --> 00:20:53.930
when they're really engaged, I.

472
00:20:54.330 --> 00:20:56.650
It's. It's. I say it's kind of easy. It

473
00:20:56.650 --> 00:20:58.970
flows. They're. They're engaged, they're

474
00:20:58.970 --> 00:21:01.850
motivated, they're committed, and so they

475
00:21:01.850 --> 00:21:04.480
come in ready to work. And one of the

476
00:21:04.790 --> 00:21:07.670
things that I love. I so love this. And I

477
00:21:07.670 --> 00:21:10.510
think the AA and NA program is so

478
00:21:10.510 --> 00:21:13.270
wonderful about this. How

479
00:21:13.270 --> 00:21:16.150
people in recovery learn.

480
00:21:16.550 --> 00:21:19.550
Recovery from addiction learn themselves so

481
00:21:19.550 --> 00:21:22.510
well. They. They have to. To. To know

482
00:21:22.510 --> 00:21:24.190
what their triggers are to keep from

483
00:21:24.190 --> 00:21:27.190
relapsing. So in mental health,

484
00:21:28.470 --> 00:21:31.310
when I have a client come in, and instead of

485
00:21:31.310 --> 00:21:33.740
saying, this is what they did to me, you

486
00:21:33.740 --> 00:21:35.540
know, talking about another family member,

487
00:21:35.540 --> 00:21:38.420
when they come in and they say, this is what

488
00:21:38.420 --> 00:21:40.500
I did. This is how I feel this is what I did,

489
00:21:40.500 --> 00:21:42.900
this is what I said. And they take ownership.

490
00:21:43.300 --> 00:21:45.780
Whoa. That's such a wonderful sign.

491
00:21:46.180 --> 00:21:48.980
Then we're off to the races. And what I tell

492
00:21:48.980 --> 00:21:51.940
people, too, and it's so important.

493
00:21:52.260 --> 00:21:54.340
And Valerie, you're such a good example of

494
00:21:54.340 --> 00:21:57.140
this. And Helen, I'm sure, too, there is

495
00:21:57.140 --> 00:22:00.020
a point, you know, in the very beginning of

496
00:22:00.020 --> 00:22:02.940
healing, it's kind of hard, you know, there's

497
00:22:02.940 --> 00:22:04.760
resistance and you're working, working

498
00:22:04.760 --> 00:22:07.080
against years of, you know, either blowing up

499
00:22:07.080 --> 00:22:09.920
or keeping everything in. But you

500
00:22:10.080 --> 00:22:12.920
go to enough sessions and there is a

501
00:22:12.920 --> 00:22:15.640
momentum that starts, that never

502
00:22:15.640 --> 00:22:18.520
stops. It will go the rest of your life and

503
00:22:18.520 --> 00:22:21.120
it will serve you later on when you're not in

504
00:22:21.120 --> 00:22:23.920
that therapist's office, when you are in a

505
00:22:23.920 --> 00:22:26.400
difficult situation, if you've had enough

506
00:22:26.400 --> 00:22:29.200
therapy and healing, those healthy things

507
00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:31.570
just kick in and you don't need the

508
00:22:31.570 --> 00:22:33.970
therapist. It's all been internalized. And

509
00:22:33.970 --> 00:22:35.810
you know, you. You know what to do when

510
00:22:35.810 --> 00:22:37.930
you're triggered. You know what triggers you.

511
00:22:39.290 --> 00:22:41.330
So that's what, to me, that's what I'm always

512
00:22:41.330 --> 00:22:44.170
working for, is for a.

513
00:22:44.170 --> 00:22:47.050
For the clients to come in and start

514
00:22:47.050 --> 00:22:48.730
right off the bat talking about themselves,

515
00:22:48.970 --> 00:22:51.890
not blaming, and also that

516
00:22:51.890 --> 00:22:53.730
they come long enough and are committed long

517
00:22:53.730 --> 00:22:56.730
enough that I can see that growth and healing

518
00:22:56.950 --> 00:22:59.660
and in situations outside of the session,

519
00:23:00.780 --> 00:23:03.340
that it's taken on a life of its own,

520
00:23:04.300 --> 00:23:07.140
that they don't need the therapy so much that

521
00:23:07.140 --> 00:23:07.820
they're doing it.

522
00:23:16.940 --> 00:23:19.580
When did making plans get this complicated?

523
00:23:20.460 --> 00:23:23.230
It's time to streamline with WhatsApp, the

524
00:23:23.230 --> 00:23:24.990
secure messaging app that brings the whole

525
00:23:24.990 --> 00:23:27.390
group together. Use polls to settle dinner

526
00:23:27.390 --> 00:23:30.150
plans, send event invites, and pin messages

527
00:23:30.150 --> 00:23:32.950
so no one forgets mom's 60th. And

528
00:23:32.950 --> 00:23:35.510
never miss a meme or milestone. All protected

529
00:23:35.510 --> 00:23:37.030
with end to end encryption.

530
00:23:37.190 --> 00:23:39.910
Helen Sneed: It's time for WhatsApp message privately with

531
00:23:39.910 --> 00:23:40.230
everyone.

532
00:23:40.470 --> 00:23:42.150
Speaker A: Learn more at WhatsApp.com.

533
00:23:45.830 --> 00:23:47.230
Valerie Milburn: Adjective used to.

534
00:23:47.230 --> 00:23:49.150
Speaker A: Describe an individual whose spirit is

535
00:23:49.150 --> 00:23:51.980
unyielding, unconstrained. One who navigates

536
00:23:51.980 --> 00:23:54.660
life on their own terms, effortlessly.

537
00:23:54.900 --> 00:23:56.260
They do not always show up on.

538
00:23:56.260 --> 00:23:58.900
Valerie Milburn: Time, but when they arrive, you notice

539
00:23:59.220 --> 00:24:00.980
an individual confident in their

540
00:24:01.060 --> 00:24:02.020
contradictions.

541
00:24:04.260 --> 00:24:06.420
They know the rules, but behave as if they do

542
00:24:06.420 --> 00:24:07.060
not exist.

543
00:24:08.500 --> 00:24:10.860
Speaker A: New Teen, the new fragrance by Miu.

544
00:24:10.860 --> 00:24:12.500
Valerie Milburn: Miu, defined by you.

545
00:24:13.380 --> 00:24:15.580
Speaker A: Finally, in your wellness era, then you.

546
00:24:15.580 --> 00:24:17.380
Valerie Milburn: Know gut health is gut wealth.

547
00:24:17.460 --> 00:24:19.100
Speaker A: And with 20 years of science behind.

548
00:24:19.100 --> 00:24:21.420
Valerie Milburn: It, Activia can help keep those good gut

549
00:24:21.420 --> 00:24:23.840
vibes. Vibes going. Deliciously smooth and

550
00:24:23.840 --> 00:24:24.360
creamy.

551
00:24:24.360 --> 00:24:27.080
Speaker A: Activia probiotic yogurts and dailies have

552
00:24:27.080 --> 00:24:29.440
billions of live and active probiotics and

553
00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:31.240
help support gut health while you go about

554
00:24:31.240 --> 00:24:31.680
your day.

555
00:24:31.760 --> 00:24:34.000
Valerie Milburn: Your gut is where it all begins. So start

556
00:24:34.000 --> 00:24:36.480
with Activia. Enjoying Activia twice a day

557
00:24:36.480 --> 00:24:36.760
for two.

558
00:24:36.760 --> 00:24:38.680
Speaker A: Weeks as part of a balanced diet and healthy

559
00:24:38.680 --> 00:24:40.600
lifestyle can help reduce the frequency of

560
00:24:40.600 --> 00:24:42.160
minor digestive discomfort.

561
00:24:44.400 --> 00:24:47.360
Helen Sneed: Well, that's a. I'm sorry, that can

562
00:24:47.360 --> 00:24:49.760
sound. I'm sure it can seem so magical

563
00:24:49.920 --> 00:24:51.840
depending on the family and the situation,

564
00:24:51.920 --> 00:24:54.280
but. But I'm thinking of some families I know

565
00:24:54.280 --> 00:24:56.720
where I think, man, she'd have to wave a

566
00:24:56.720 --> 00:24:58.000
wand. But that's okay.

567
00:24:59.600 --> 00:25:00.800
Something will work, right?

568
00:25:01.200 --> 00:25:04.080
Speaker A: It does take a while. It does. It can

569
00:25:04.080 --> 00:25:06.480
take a while. Yes. To get to that point.

570
00:25:07.200 --> 00:25:10.040
Helen Sneed: Yeah. Well, I find

571
00:25:10.040 --> 00:25:12.560
all this so fascinating. Now, here's one

572
00:25:13.120 --> 00:25:16.000
that I think is really important, which

573
00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:18.560
is how can family members

574
00:25:18.640 --> 00:25:21.340
identify the line between

575
00:25:21.420 --> 00:25:23.820
being helpful and enabling

576
00:25:23.980 --> 00:25:25.500
unhealthy behaviors?

577
00:25:26.220 --> 00:25:28.340
Speaker A: Yeah, it's.

578
00:25:28.340 --> 00:25:30.060
Helen Sneed: Well, one seems like you could really get.

579
00:25:30.060 --> 00:25:32.100
You could really step in the hornet's nest if

580
00:25:32.100 --> 00:25:33.420
you got into this kind of thing.

581
00:25:33.740 --> 00:25:36.460
Speaker A: Yes. You know, on the one hand, it's.

582
00:25:37.180 --> 00:25:39.100
It's about being in touch with yourself and

583
00:25:39.100 --> 00:25:42.100
your boundaries. So there is such

584
00:25:42.100 --> 00:25:44.780
a difference between being supportive and

585
00:25:44.780 --> 00:25:47.340
helping, but not rescuing and not going

586
00:25:47.340 --> 00:25:49.620
against your boundaries. And, you know, there

587
00:25:49.620 --> 00:25:52.100
may be times that I loved something that

588
00:25:52.100 --> 00:25:54.940
Bernadette said when she was talking.

589
00:25:55.100 --> 00:25:56.860
Valerie's sister, when she was talking about,

590
00:25:56.940 --> 00:25:59.180
you know, supporting Valerie during her

591
00:25:59.180 --> 00:26:02.020
crisis. You family members

592
00:26:02.020 --> 00:26:04.340
may be able to be there and be supportive and

593
00:26:04.340 --> 00:26:06.540
be there for the children when there's a

594
00:26:06.540 --> 00:26:08.460
crisis going on, but there may be a time

595
00:26:08.460 --> 00:26:10.220
there may be something going on internally

596
00:26:10.380 --> 00:26:12.700
with them, and they just have to say, okay, I

597
00:26:12.700 --> 00:26:15.460
need to back away for a little bit. Not

598
00:26:15.460 --> 00:26:18.260
forever, but for a little bit, I need

599
00:26:18.260 --> 00:26:20.300
to back away and take care of my own mental

600
00:26:20.300 --> 00:26:23.140
health and I'll be back. But I love that she

601
00:26:23.140 --> 00:26:25.220
said something to Malcolm about it, too, that

602
00:26:26.420 --> 00:26:28.580
just a little heads up. There's some things

603
00:26:28.580 --> 00:26:30.940
going on with me. I want to be here for you

604
00:26:30.940 --> 00:26:33.140
and for the kids, but I need to just step

605
00:26:33.140 --> 00:26:35.940
away for a little bit. So it

606
00:26:36.500 --> 00:26:37.540
let me jump in for a second.

607
00:26:37.540 --> 00:26:39.180
Valerie Milburn: Also on that episode you're talking about

608
00:26:39.180 --> 00:26:41.960
that Bernadette was on about the

609
00:26:41.960 --> 00:26:44.720
not doing for me what I could do for myself

610
00:26:44.720 --> 00:26:47.000
kind of thing. Not rescuing. She said at some

611
00:26:47.000 --> 00:26:50.000
point she couldn't help me directly, but she

612
00:26:50.000 --> 00:26:51.920
could help me by taking care of the kids. She

613
00:26:51.920 --> 00:26:53.400
said at some point there was nothing she

614
00:26:53.400 --> 00:26:55.440
could directly do for me, that she couldn't

615
00:26:55.440 --> 00:26:57.640
rescue me. She had nothing. There was

616
00:26:57.640 --> 00:27:00.560
nothing. I was. She couldn't do anything for

617
00:27:00.560 --> 00:27:03.320
me. But take care of the kids. So that was

618
00:27:03.400 --> 00:27:05.520
her not break, you know, crossing that line

619
00:27:05.520 --> 00:27:07.890
of trying to rescue me rather than

620
00:27:08.130 --> 00:27:09.650
supporting me. And so.

621
00:27:10.370 --> 00:27:13.290
Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And you

622
00:27:13.290 --> 00:27:16.210
don't like, say, a person that's in recovery

623
00:27:16.290 --> 00:27:19.210
from an addiction, you

624
00:27:19.210 --> 00:27:21.650
don't want to ask about their program? You

625
00:27:21.650 --> 00:27:23.530
know, I know in the beginning there's a lot

626
00:27:23.530 --> 00:27:25.490
of fear about relapse and things like that,

627
00:27:25.490 --> 00:27:27.650
but their program is their program. And

628
00:27:27.650 --> 00:27:29.810
hopefully family members are going to Al Anon

629
00:27:29.810 --> 00:27:32.130
or whatever. Their own self care

630
00:27:32.610 --> 00:27:35.370
is very important. So

631
00:27:35.370 --> 00:27:38.290
you. You want to be careful not to get

632
00:27:38.290 --> 00:27:40.570
into that role

633
00:27:40.970 --> 00:27:43.690
of having of kind of their police

634
00:27:43.690 --> 00:27:45.730
or whatever, you know, to make sure they're

635
00:27:45.730 --> 00:27:48.650
doing recovery correctly or whatever that's.

636
00:27:48.650 --> 00:27:51.530
That's theirs really to do. And

637
00:27:51.610 --> 00:27:53.610
I guess another thing I'd like to say is

638
00:27:54.330 --> 00:27:57.010
that probably had to do. I should have said

639
00:27:57.010 --> 00:27:59.770
this long ago. It takes a village. My

640
00:27:59.770 --> 00:28:02.650
gosh, you know, it listening

641
00:28:02.650 --> 00:28:05.460
to your family,

642
00:28:05.540 --> 00:28:07.620
Valerie. And you know, Malcolm had his own

643
00:28:07.620 --> 00:28:10.020
therapist. You had a good psychiatrist. You

644
00:28:10.020 --> 00:28:12.420
all did couples therapy.

645
00:28:13.540 --> 00:28:16.260
It takes all of that. And as a family

646
00:28:16.260 --> 00:28:18.260
therapist, I can't do it all by myself

647
00:28:18.260 --> 00:28:20.980
either. You know, I have a network of

648
00:28:21.060 --> 00:28:23.620
psychiatrists and other therapists and

649
00:28:23.700 --> 00:28:26.500
definitely the NA AAA community and

650
00:28:26.980 --> 00:28:28.700
people that I know that are affiliated with

651
00:28:28.700 --> 00:28:31.540
nami. It takes a whole

652
00:28:31.540 --> 00:28:34.460
village. One person can't

653
00:28:34.460 --> 00:28:35.860
do it by themselves with a family.

654
00:28:37.540 --> 00:28:39.540
It takes a whole village to really help them

655
00:28:39.540 --> 00:28:41.620
and everybody kind of playing their part and

656
00:28:41.620 --> 00:28:43.740
getting releases signed so you can talk to

657
00:28:43.740 --> 00:28:46.620
each other. It's. That's the best way to do

658
00:28:46.620 --> 00:28:47.620
it in a perfect world.

659
00:28:53.780 --> 00:28:56.710
Valerie Milburn: Well, talking

660
00:28:56.710 --> 00:28:58.710
about bringing everybody in and taking a

661
00:28:58.710 --> 00:29:00.750
village, when you're working with an

662
00:29:00.750 --> 00:29:03.230
individual in therapy, when. What persuades

663
00:29:03.230 --> 00:29:05.390
you to bring in their village? What persuade

664
00:29:05.390 --> 00:29:08.070
you to bring in the family and involve the

665
00:29:08.070 --> 00:29:10.190
family in their. In their therapy and their

666
00:29:10.190 --> 00:29:10.670
treatment?

667
00:29:12.910 --> 00:29:14.950
Speaker A: It's an interesting. That's an interesting

668
00:29:14.950 --> 00:29:17.950
question because it seems to me like you kind

669
00:29:17.950 --> 00:29:20.630
of have the mindset of a family systems

670
00:29:20.630 --> 00:29:23.300
therapist or you don't. You know, I will

671
00:29:23.300 --> 00:29:25.740
always prefer to bring in as many other

672
00:29:25.740 --> 00:29:28.700
family members as I can. And in my own

673
00:29:28.780 --> 00:29:31.020
therapy, when I was in therapy,

674
00:29:31.820 --> 00:29:32.860
my therapist,

675
00:29:34.620 --> 00:29:36.740
she'd get in any family members of mine that

676
00:29:36.740 --> 00:29:39.380
she could. My mother lived on the other side

677
00:29:39.380 --> 00:29:41.300
of Texas. And when my mother would come

678
00:29:41.300 --> 00:29:43.180
visit, my therapist would say, you want to

679
00:29:43.180 --> 00:29:45.540
bring your mother in next week? Yeah, I'll

680
00:29:45.540 --> 00:29:47.820
bring her in. So. And you know, if things

681
00:29:47.820 --> 00:29:49.820
were going on with my husband, she'd be like,

682
00:29:49.820 --> 00:29:51.940
well, why don't you bring Craig in? So, okay,

683
00:29:51.940 --> 00:29:53.800
yeah, I'll bring him in. And it was so

684
00:29:54.040 --> 00:29:56.600
beneficial. I guess that's another thing that

685
00:29:56.600 --> 00:29:59.320
influenced me, was her therapy with me.

686
00:29:59.400 --> 00:30:02.080
And she. And it was interesting because

687
00:30:02.080 --> 00:30:04.120
she'd been working with me for a long time,

688
00:30:04.120 --> 00:30:07.000
but she was so kind and including when

689
00:30:07.000 --> 00:30:09.320
my mother and my husband would come in, and

690
00:30:10.200 --> 00:30:12.480
they didn't ever seem to feel like she and I

691
00:30:12.480 --> 00:30:15.200
had this special relationship, and they were

692
00:30:15.200 --> 00:30:18.120
like outsiders. She was masterful at

693
00:30:18.840 --> 00:30:21.080
wondering, you know, and being

694
00:30:21.720 --> 00:30:23.960
inclusive of everybody. So

695
00:30:25.640 --> 00:30:28.360
I. I like, especially if it's a young person,

696
00:30:28.920 --> 00:30:31.480
if it's late teens or early

697
00:30:31.560 --> 00:30:34.440
20s, and a lot of times

698
00:30:34.440 --> 00:30:37.320
with a thought disorder, one of the.

699
00:30:37.800 --> 00:30:39.760
Maybe forms of schizophrenia or something

700
00:30:39.760 --> 00:30:40.280
like that.

701
00:30:42.520 --> 00:30:45.080
Those. Those young people

702
00:30:45.560 --> 00:30:48.440
don't usually come in on their own.

703
00:30:48.440 --> 00:30:51.160
They're usually in a crisis, and the family

704
00:30:51.810 --> 00:30:54.610
will bring them in. But there are young

705
00:30:54.610 --> 00:30:57.610
people that will have either one of the

706
00:30:57.610 --> 00:30:59.210
thought disorders. I mean, one of the mood

707
00:30:59.210 --> 00:31:02.050
disorders, I'm sorry, a form

708
00:31:02.050 --> 00:31:04.650
of anxiety or depression. They're having

709
00:31:04.650 --> 00:31:07.609
problems in college, and so they are

710
00:31:07.609 --> 00:31:09.450
usually coming in on their own. And right off

711
00:31:09.450 --> 00:31:11.850
the bat, I'll let them know. One of the

712
00:31:11.850 --> 00:31:14.410
things that I'm. That I do is family

713
00:31:14.410 --> 00:31:17.250
therapy. And so I

714
00:31:17.250 --> 00:31:19.770
used to kind of almost have a rule that when

715
00:31:19.770 --> 00:31:22.570
I saw these young people, I like to bring the

716
00:31:22.570 --> 00:31:25.310
family in once every four to six weeks,

717
00:31:25.790 --> 00:31:28.030
something like that, because I've just seen

718
00:31:28.190 --> 00:31:31.030
too many young people find a

719
00:31:31.030 --> 00:31:33.950
good individual therapist, and they grow and

720
00:31:34.110 --> 00:31:37.070
heal. But, you know, our

721
00:31:37.070 --> 00:31:38.910
issues don't start in a vacuum.

722
00:31:39.870 --> 00:31:42.870
It's very good to

723
00:31:42.870 --> 00:31:45.110
include the family. And a lot of times the

724
00:31:45.110 --> 00:31:47.510
family feels like they're on the outside, and

725
00:31:47.510 --> 00:31:49.250
so this one member is getting all this

726
00:31:50.680 --> 00:31:53.200
work, and they really needed. Need to be

727
00:31:53.200 --> 00:31:56.160
included. So I'm a big proponent of that, you

728
00:31:56.160 --> 00:31:58.000
know, and I tell them right off the bat, like

729
00:31:58.000 --> 00:32:00.320
I said, right off the bat. I'm also a family

730
00:32:00.320 --> 00:32:02.360
therapist, and I'd like to see your family.

731
00:32:02.360 --> 00:32:05.199
And then we kind of go from there. It's. It's

732
00:32:05.199 --> 00:32:06.440
almost always helpful.

733
00:32:06.520 --> 00:32:08.440
Valerie Milburn: Yeah. Malcolm talked about how. And I talked

734
00:32:08.440 --> 00:32:10.320
about how grateful I was that I signed that

735
00:32:10.320 --> 00:32:13.280
release so that my psychiatrist

736
00:32:13.280 --> 00:32:16.200
could talk to him and that he did come in.

737
00:32:16.200 --> 00:32:18.280
But even the ongoing communication when I was

738
00:32:18.280 --> 00:32:20.400
super sick, that Malcolm was able to talk to

739
00:32:20.400 --> 00:32:22.940
my psychiatrist was it. I knew it was

740
00:32:22.940 --> 00:32:25.100
imperative. And he talked about it on the

741
00:32:25.100 --> 00:32:27.500
podcast that he was so grateful to have that

742
00:32:27.500 --> 00:32:28.580
communication with him.

743
00:32:29.380 --> 00:32:32.260
Speaker A: I heard that that was so, so good that

744
00:32:32.260 --> 00:32:34.540
that happened. I mean, it's. It's so

745
00:32:34.540 --> 00:32:36.740
important to have that. One other thing I'd

746
00:32:36.740 --> 00:32:39.580
like to Say about that, that as a

747
00:32:39.580 --> 00:32:42.500
family therapist, if you have

748
00:32:42.500 --> 00:32:45.300
an acting out young

749
00:32:45.300 --> 00:32:48.180
person, their late teens, early 20s,

750
00:32:48.740 --> 00:32:51.140
and it's not really a thought disorder, they

751
00:32:51.140 --> 00:32:53.680
don't have schizophrenia or. But

752
00:32:53.840 --> 00:32:56.840
they're acting out either. You

753
00:32:56.840 --> 00:32:58.400
know, they're just not doing well, they're

754
00:32:58.400 --> 00:33:00.560
not functioning well in their life. I mean, a

755
00:33:00.560 --> 00:33:03.560
lot of times they're expressing

756
00:33:03.560 --> 00:33:06.560
a symptom in the family. And so again,

757
00:33:06.800 --> 00:33:09.039
you know, if you just work with them and you

758
00:33:09.039 --> 00:33:10.160
don't involve the family,

759
00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:14.920
you can help them in some ways. I mean, they

760
00:33:14.920 --> 00:33:17.600
can learn about communication and, you know,

761
00:33:17.600 --> 00:33:19.560
and develop a trusting relationship with you.

762
00:33:19.560 --> 00:33:21.760
And that's good. But if that

763
00:33:23.260 --> 00:33:26.140
symptom in the family, you know, if they

764
00:33:26.140 --> 00:33:29.020
take away that if you don't help heal the

765
00:33:29.020 --> 00:33:31.180
family, the family will replace it with

766
00:33:31.180 --> 00:33:34.180
something else. I mean, it's just imperative

767
00:33:34.180 --> 00:33:37.020
that you, that you include as many members of

768
00:33:37.020 --> 00:33:37.980
the family as you can.

769
00:33:39.900 --> 00:33:42.340
Helen Sneed: Well, that's, that's good to know. And I, I

770
00:33:42.340 --> 00:33:44.860
wonder how many people have the

771
00:33:44.860 --> 00:33:46.980
opportunity to actually do that, you know,

772
00:33:46.980 --> 00:33:48.750
people in therapy that, that

773
00:33:49.710 --> 00:33:52.110
don't have you. Yeah,

774
00:33:52.510 --> 00:33:55.350
yeah, but here's a big one. And you know,

775
00:33:55.350 --> 00:33:57.030
we're always, we like to get into the

776
00:33:57.030 --> 00:33:59.870
pragmatic side of things. But what

777
00:34:00.350 --> 00:34:03.310
skills, methods, pursuits, books, games,

778
00:34:03.710 --> 00:34:06.350
group activities can bring a family together,

779
00:34:06.910 --> 00:34:09.790
promote understanding, and provide an area

780
00:34:09.870 --> 00:34:12.110
of stability in difficult,

781
00:34:12.430 --> 00:34:13.900
volatile relationships?

782
00:34:15.489 --> 00:34:18.369
Speaker A: Okay, let's see. Let's start with

783
00:34:19.329 --> 00:34:22.329
kind of family activities that

784
00:34:22.329 --> 00:34:24.449
could bring a family together,

785
00:34:26.049 --> 00:34:28.449
especially if it is a family that is

786
00:34:28.689 --> 00:34:31.609
disengaged. As a family therapist, I look

787
00:34:31.609 --> 00:34:34.369
for either enmeshed families. You know,

788
00:34:34.369 --> 00:34:37.249
they, they're too, they're,

789
00:34:37.249 --> 00:34:39.529
they're not bonded because you want them to

790
00:34:39.529 --> 00:34:41.409
have a bond, but they feel each other's

791
00:34:41.409 --> 00:34:42.809
feelings too much. There's not much

792
00:34:42.809 --> 00:34:45.169
individual being. They're, they're all kind

793
00:34:45.169 --> 00:34:48.030
of fused. So there's that or there's a

794
00:34:48.270 --> 00:34:50.870
disengaged family and every man is out for

795
00:34:50.870 --> 00:34:52.430
himself. You know, they're, they're not

796
00:34:53.230 --> 00:34:56.150
joined enough. So I would say

797
00:34:56.150 --> 00:34:58.790
with some of those disengaged families, we'd

798
00:34:58.790 --> 00:35:00.710
start looking for family activities that they

799
00:35:00.710 --> 00:35:03.630
could do together where they

800
00:35:03.630 --> 00:35:06.430
have just to be together, family

801
00:35:06.430 --> 00:35:09.270
movie night, definitely that the parents are

802
00:35:09.270 --> 00:35:11.310
doing things together as a couple.

803
00:35:12.600 --> 00:35:14.000
There's a lot of different ways that you can

804
00:35:14.000 --> 00:35:16.320
do that. Are the parents involved in the kids

805
00:35:16.320 --> 00:35:18.600
sports? You know, what are some local

806
00:35:18.600 --> 00:35:21.000
activities that they can go do together

807
00:35:21.640 --> 00:35:24.200
as a family? Hiking, being out in nature.

808
00:35:24.840 --> 00:35:27.360
You know, sometimes families get so busy

809
00:35:27.360 --> 00:35:29.320
working and you know, they're just putting

810
00:35:29.320 --> 00:35:31.120
one foot in front of the other. They've got

811
00:35:31.120 --> 00:35:33.040
so much on their plate. Sometimes they don't

812
00:35:33.040 --> 00:35:35.040
think about some of these activities they

813
00:35:35.040 --> 00:35:37.960
could do. So fun activities.

814
00:35:38.200 --> 00:35:40.480
Oh, I always look for the families that look

815
00:35:40.480 --> 00:35:42.520
like they have fun together and they can be a

816
00:35:42.520 --> 00:35:45.180
little light hearted sometimes they're very

817
00:35:45.180 --> 00:35:48.060
serious and angry and it's just

818
00:35:48.060 --> 00:35:50.100
right below the surface. So how to increase

819
00:35:50.260 --> 00:35:52.340
fun in their lives.

820
00:35:54.260 --> 00:35:56.500
But there's so much online

821
00:35:56.980 --> 00:35:58.740
help these days.

822
00:35:59.780 --> 00:36:02.620
I practice in a small town and we

823
00:36:02.620 --> 00:36:05.500
don't have as many support groups but there

824
00:36:05.500 --> 00:36:07.700
are a lot that is offered online

825
00:36:08.340 --> 00:36:10.300
and I think there's a lot of NAMI groups.

826
00:36:10.300 --> 00:36:12.100
Valerie Milburn: A lot of NAMI groups online. Yes.

827
00:36:12.660 --> 00:36:15.560
Speaker A: Yeah. So getting involved in

828
00:36:15.560 --> 00:36:17.880
some of those things. If there's an addiction

829
00:36:17.880 --> 00:36:20.800
in the family, going to

830
00:36:20.960 --> 00:36:23.760
Al Anon Alatein AA

831
00:36:23.840 --> 00:36:26.320
na. You know, sometimes

832
00:36:27.440 --> 00:36:29.680
those support groups have their own

833
00:36:29.680 --> 00:36:32.520
communities and I found them and you know,

834
00:36:32.520 --> 00:36:34.440
you want to be selective about the groups

835
00:36:34.440 --> 00:36:36.600
that you go to because some are better than

836
00:36:36.600 --> 00:36:38.520
others or some fill your needs better than

837
00:36:38.520 --> 00:36:40.480
others. But starting to build a community

838
00:36:41.130 --> 00:36:42.330
that you feel a part of.

839
00:36:44.570 --> 00:36:47.570
Let's see, skills and methods.

840
00:36:47.570 --> 00:36:49.610
I mean I'm always working on communication

841
00:36:49.610 --> 00:36:52.330
with. With the family members. I

842
00:36:52.330 --> 00:36:54.970
see. I did a fun

843
00:36:55.530 --> 00:36:58.170
method with one of the families I saw

844
00:36:59.290 --> 00:37:01.290
years ago when I was learning about the.

845
00:37:01.290 --> 00:37:02.890
These energy centers in the body.

846
00:37:04.170 --> 00:37:06.970
I had a mom and a dad and they had

847
00:37:06.970 --> 00:37:08.930
three daughters and I think it was the oldest

848
00:37:08.930 --> 00:37:10.170
daughter that was starting to have some

849
00:37:10.170 --> 00:37:12.170
problems and they were real open to family

850
00:37:12.170 --> 00:37:15.110
therap. So they came in and

851
00:37:15.670 --> 00:37:18.110
the oldest daughter was, you know, she was a

852
00:37:18.110 --> 00:37:20.590
pretty teenager. She's a little surly and a

853
00:37:20.590 --> 00:37:23.470
little separate from everybody. And so I

854
00:37:23.470 --> 00:37:26.390
did an exercise with them where I taught them

855
00:37:27.110 --> 00:37:29.670
breathing and how to be grounded

856
00:37:29.910 --> 00:37:32.310
and how to open their hearts. And we did it

857
00:37:32.310 --> 00:37:34.910
together. And I had, I saw them a couple of

858
00:37:34.910 --> 00:37:37.790
times not doing that exercise

859
00:37:37.790 --> 00:37:39.270
and then it was probably like the third

860
00:37:39.270 --> 00:37:42.030
session I did that exercise and just teaching

861
00:37:42.030 --> 00:37:43.710
them how to open their hearts. Hearts while

862
00:37:43.710 --> 00:37:46.270
they were talking to each other. It was

863
00:37:46.270 --> 00:37:49.190
amazing. It was just amazing. So I'll try

864
00:37:49.190 --> 00:37:49.990
to think of

865
00:37:51.910 --> 00:37:54.790
little methods like that that to

866
00:37:54.790 --> 00:37:57.430
me utilize the body, get them out of their

867
00:37:57.430 --> 00:38:00.150
head and help them communicate

868
00:38:00.790 --> 00:38:03.710
better with each other. Let's

869
00:38:03.710 --> 00:38:05.830
see. Books. Gosh. I,

870
00:38:07.110 --> 00:38:09.910
I was really hooked on all this is

871
00:38:09.910 --> 00:38:12.910
back in the 90s though. Pia Melody and

872
00:38:12.910 --> 00:38:15.810
John Bradshaw. All of the

873
00:38:15.810 --> 00:38:18.610
books about adult children of alcoholics

874
00:38:19.410 --> 00:38:21.810
because that my father died of

875
00:38:21.810 --> 00:38:24.650
alcoholism and my, my oldest sister

876
00:38:24.650 --> 00:38:27.610
died of addiction. So all those roles

877
00:38:27.610 --> 00:38:30.290
and rules are. I really resonated to all

878
00:38:30.290 --> 00:38:33.090
that. But there's a lot of new

879
00:38:34.850 --> 00:38:37.530
family therapists that are so, they're so

880
00:38:37.530 --> 00:38:40.290
good. I heard of

881
00:38:40.290 --> 00:38:42.210
a new guy the other day, Gabor Mata.

882
00:38:42.760 --> 00:38:43.960
Valerie Milburn: Oh, yeah, yeah.

883
00:38:44.680 --> 00:38:47.280
Speaker A: Excellent. People really respond to him. The

884
00:38:47.280 --> 00:38:49.800
Brene Brown information is really great.

885
00:38:51.880 --> 00:38:54.880
And, and I would say too, with. When family

886
00:38:54.880 --> 00:38:57.480
members come in and there is a need for

887
00:38:57.480 --> 00:38:59.480
psychiatrist and medication,

888
00:39:01.000 --> 00:39:03.480
I'll, I'll point them to some of the

889
00:39:04.120 --> 00:39:06.040
online resources like the American

890
00:39:06.120 --> 00:39:09.000
Psychiatric Association. Mayo Clinic

891
00:39:09.000 --> 00:39:10.600
has some good information. Duke University

892
00:39:10.680 --> 00:39:13.240
has some good information. But to be very

893
00:39:13.240 --> 00:39:16.220
care about that, I, I find that the hospitals

894
00:39:16.220 --> 00:39:19.020
and the research hospitals are the best

895
00:39:19.020 --> 00:39:21.060
place for information like, say, if they're

896
00:39:21.060 --> 00:39:23.460
wanting to know some of the

897
00:39:26.340 --> 00:39:29.060
characteristics of bipolar disorder or

898
00:39:30.340 --> 00:39:33.060
fentanyl addiction or whatever, you know, be,

899
00:39:33.060 --> 00:39:36.060
be careful online. Don't

900
00:39:36.060 --> 00:39:38.020
just get it off a TikTok or wherever.

901
00:39:38.180 --> 00:39:38.620
Valerie Milburn: Yeah.

902
00:39:38.620 --> 00:39:41.020
Speaker A: Go to one of the, you know, tried and true

903
00:39:41.020 --> 00:39:43.300
medical website.

904
00:39:43.460 --> 00:39:45.420
Valerie Milburn: Yeah. My doctor said these are the ones you

905
00:39:45.420 --> 00:39:47.420
can go to. These are the only ones you can go

906
00:39:47.420 --> 00:39:49.980
to. And the three you just gave are the ones

907
00:39:49.980 --> 00:39:52.940
he said. Yeah, yeah. And, and Harvard and

908
00:39:52.940 --> 00:39:55.340
the other major research universities. But

909
00:39:55.340 --> 00:39:57.620
those are the ones he, he gave. And, and

910
00:39:57.620 --> 00:40:00.100
Helen and I rely on those as well for our own

911
00:40:00.100 --> 00:40:01.460
research. Yeah.

912
00:40:02.420 --> 00:40:05.340
Speaker A: What, what else can you, what else

913
00:40:05.340 --> 00:40:07.860
can I add to that that you'd like to know?

914
00:40:07.940 --> 00:40:09.940
Valerie Milburn: That those were great. Can you think of any

915
00:40:09.940 --> 00:40:10.180
more?

916
00:40:10.180 --> 00:40:12.920
Helen Sneed: Yeah, I think that was really, really

917
00:40:13.400 --> 00:40:15.960
full of good advice

918
00:40:17.160 --> 00:40:20.040
and ways. Again, it gets back

919
00:40:20.040 --> 00:40:22.880
to the communications question. I think is so

920
00:40:22.880 --> 00:40:25.680
important that a lot of these things I'm

921
00:40:25.680 --> 00:40:28.480
asking about I think can help foster better

922
00:40:28.480 --> 00:40:30.640
communications within the family and that

923
00:40:30.640 --> 00:40:31.240
kind of thing.

924
00:40:33.480 --> 00:40:35.440
Speaker A: Let me add one other thing because I think it

925
00:40:35.440 --> 00:40:38.210
was your guest, Rebecca, that said

926
00:40:38.210 --> 00:40:40.210
something about this that I thought was so

927
00:40:40.210 --> 00:40:42.530
excellent. When we're talking about

928
00:40:42.530 --> 00:40:45.090
communication, I always

929
00:40:45.170 --> 00:40:47.810
tell my clients it's going to feel

930
00:40:47.810 --> 00:40:50.770
uncomfortable because for those people that

931
00:40:51.170 --> 00:40:53.810
kind of over emote, that are very emotional

932
00:40:53.810 --> 00:40:56.490
and maybe they get angry real quickly, I'm

933
00:40:56.490 --> 00:40:59.490
going to teach them how to pause, not

934
00:40:59.490 --> 00:41:01.730
to emote when they're triggered. How to

935
00:41:01.730 --> 00:41:04.610
pause. Pause their communication. And it is

936
00:41:04.610 --> 00:41:07.290
the opposite with my clients that hold

937
00:41:07.290 --> 00:41:09.190
everything in. I'm going to teach them to

938
00:41:09.190 --> 00:41:12.070
speak up, you know, to, to let it come up

939
00:41:12.070 --> 00:41:14.910
and out. So it depends on the person

940
00:41:14.990 --> 00:41:16.830
about communication, but it's always

941
00:41:16.830 --> 00:41:18.670
uncomfortable. It doesn't feel like the

942
00:41:18.670 --> 00:41:21.190
natural thing because the natural thing to do

943
00:41:21.190 --> 00:41:22.750
when they're triggered is to do what they've

944
00:41:22.750 --> 00:41:25.590
always done, which, you know, I think

945
00:41:25.590 --> 00:41:27.590
that she was talking about learning how to

946
00:41:27.590 --> 00:41:30.110
pause when she was triggered. And I

947
00:41:30.110 --> 00:41:32.790
loved, loved, love that because for Very

948
00:41:32.790 --> 00:41:34.590
emotionally reactive people.

949
00:41:36.090 --> 00:41:37.690
Pausing is what they need to learn.

950
00:41:38.010 --> 00:41:39.650
Valerie Milburn: Yeah, it's one of the things I read every

951
00:41:39.650 --> 00:41:41.530
morning. One of the lines, pause when

952
00:41:41.530 --> 00:41:44.490
agitated or doubtful and ask for the next

953
00:41:44.570 --> 00:41:46.090
right thought or action.

954
00:41:46.410 --> 00:41:47.050
Speaker A: I love that.

955
00:41:47.050 --> 00:41:47.850
Valerie Milburn: Try to do that.

956
00:41:48.090 --> 00:41:48.650
Speaker A: Love that.

957
00:41:49.210 --> 00:41:51.290
Valerie Milburn: I just want to throw in that NAMI's website

958
00:41:51.290 --> 00:41:53.810
is easy to remember. It's NAMI n a

959
00:41:53.810 --> 00:41:55.268
m

960
00:41:55.592 --> 00:41:58.450
I.orgnami.org and

961
00:41:58.450 --> 00:42:00.570
we always wrap up, which I hate to do. I hate

962
00:42:00.570 --> 00:42:02.200
to wrap this conversation up. My God.

963
00:42:02.270 --> 00:42:02.590
Speaker A: Gosh.

964
00:42:03.310 --> 00:42:05.590
Valerie Milburn: But we always wrap up our conversations with

965
00:42:05.590 --> 00:42:08.190
guests with a question about hope.

966
00:42:08.830 --> 00:42:11.550
And here's yours, Lisa. What possibilities

967
00:42:11.550 --> 00:42:14.030
and changes can occur within a family

968
00:42:14.030 --> 00:42:16.270
dynamic that give you hope?

969
00:42:16.750 --> 00:42:19.630
Speaker A: Oh, there's so much

970
00:42:19.630 --> 00:42:21.870
reason to have hope that sometimes that's all

971
00:42:21.870 --> 00:42:24.510
you got. That's all you got is

972
00:42:24.590 --> 00:42:27.230
hope. When you

973
00:42:27.230 --> 00:42:30.070
see family members working on their healing

974
00:42:31.180 --> 00:42:33.620
and you see them talking to each other in a

975
00:42:33.620 --> 00:42:35.100
way that they never did before,

976
00:42:36.540 --> 00:42:38.980
and you see changes in their lives, they're

977
00:42:38.980 --> 00:42:41.220
not just talking it, but you feel different

978
00:42:41.220 --> 00:42:43.740
with them. You. You hear

979
00:42:44.060 --> 00:42:46.980
differences in their stories, you

980
00:42:46.980 --> 00:42:48.300
see them taking responsibility.

981
00:42:50.220 --> 00:42:53.220
It all that gives me hope. And I know, like

982
00:42:53.220 --> 00:42:55.420
I said, if I can help them get to a point

983
00:42:56.320 --> 00:42:58.480
in that trajectory where

984
00:42:59.200 --> 00:43:01.240
they'll. They won't go backwards. They just

985
00:43:01.240 --> 00:43:03.680
won't. If they do enough work, it's onward.

986
00:43:03.840 --> 00:43:06.080
It is. It is onward. And

987
00:43:06.720 --> 00:43:08.840
this is what I was going to say to you,

988
00:43:08.840 --> 00:43:11.760
Valerie, and to Helen, too. These.

989
00:43:12.720 --> 00:43:15.280
I love to look at families from the big

990
00:43:15.280 --> 00:43:18.120
picture, you know, because

991
00:43:18.120 --> 00:43:19.800
families are timeless. There's always been

992
00:43:19.800 --> 00:43:21.760
families, and anyone

993
00:43:22.930 --> 00:43:25.290
member of a family, all it takes is one that

994
00:43:25.290 --> 00:43:28.250
has done their work to heal, changes

995
00:43:28.250 --> 00:43:30.690
the trajectory of a family for generations,

996
00:43:31.090 --> 00:43:33.770
for generations. And I love family therapy

997
00:43:33.770 --> 00:43:36.010
because I like to kind of hear where, you

998
00:43:36.010 --> 00:43:38.049
know, maybe where did the grandparents come

999
00:43:38.049 --> 00:43:39.570
from? What were the struggles they had?

1000
00:43:39.730 --> 00:43:41.690
Because then it will make that person sitting

1001
00:43:41.690 --> 00:43:43.530
in front of me. It makes much more sense to

1002
00:43:43.530 --> 00:43:46.450
me and to them. But their healing

1003
00:43:46.770 --> 00:43:49.690
causes a trajectory, and it makes

1004
00:43:49.690 --> 00:43:52.340
it. It more healthy for

1005
00:43:52.340 --> 00:43:54.780
all the future people in that family.

1006
00:43:55.260 --> 00:43:58.060
It just gives me the chills. I mean, this

1007
00:43:58.060 --> 00:44:01.020
work is. You know, it never felt like

1008
00:44:01.020 --> 00:44:02.940
a job to me. It always felt like a calling.

1009
00:44:02.940 --> 00:44:05.660
And it's magical because you see people

1010
00:44:06.380 --> 00:44:08.860
change is not easy, but it's so

1011
00:44:09.260 --> 00:44:12.220
rewarding. And to be able to see that

1012
00:44:12.220 --> 00:44:14.580
in front of your eyes. And I had to go

1013
00:44:14.580 --> 00:44:17.310
through my own, oh, therapy and support

1014
00:44:17.390 --> 00:44:19.550
groups and, you know, I did all that because

1015
00:44:19.550 --> 00:44:21.150
the family I came from, it helped me be a

1016
00:44:21.150 --> 00:44:24.030
better therapist. But it's, it's

1017
00:44:24.030 --> 00:44:26.870
Magical and wonderful. And there's a lot of

1018
00:44:26.870 --> 00:44:29.470
hope for the future. The stigma is being

1019
00:44:29.470 --> 00:44:32.390
taken away somewhat. The

1020
00:44:32.390 --> 00:44:34.510
medications that are available now

1021
00:44:35.310 --> 00:44:37.710
for, you know, for bipolar disorder,

1022
00:44:37.710 --> 00:44:39.390
depression and anxiety and

1023
00:44:39.870 --> 00:44:42.230
schizophrenia. I mean, there's a lot of stuff

1024
00:44:42.230 --> 00:44:44.480
around that was. Wasn't here when I started

1025
00:44:44.480 --> 00:44:47.320
my practice 40 years ago. A lot

1026
00:44:47.320 --> 00:44:49.920
of support, a lot of support groups,

1027
00:44:51.280 --> 00:44:53.880
a lot of education. People know a lot more

1028
00:44:53.880 --> 00:44:56.600
about mental illness and addiction. And, you

1029
00:44:56.600 --> 00:44:59.199
know, it's in all families. It's an office.

1030
00:44:59.440 --> 00:45:02.240
There's something in all families. Yeah.

1031
00:45:02.320 --> 00:45:04.000
Yeah. So hope is.

1032
00:45:04.800 --> 00:45:07.280
Absolutely. You want to keep the hope.

1033
00:45:08.640 --> 00:45:11.530
Helen Sneed: Well, I think that in

1034
00:45:11.530 --> 00:45:13.330
terms of looking at hope, which is something

1035
00:45:13.330 --> 00:45:16.050
that we. We do every. Every episode is that

1036
00:45:16.690 --> 00:45:19.250
to see that a change in

1037
00:45:19.330 --> 00:45:22.130
one family member, as you said, can.

1038
00:45:22.210 --> 00:45:24.530
Can influence the trajectory of the family

1039
00:45:24.530 --> 00:45:27.090
for generations to come, that. That's one of

1040
00:45:27.090 --> 00:45:28.690
the most hopeful things that I've ever heard.

1041
00:45:28.690 --> 00:45:30.530
Thank you for. Thanking you for bringing that

1042
00:45:30.530 --> 00:45:30.850
up.

1043
00:45:32.050 --> 00:45:33.250
Valerie Milburn: Sure, sure.

1044
00:45:33.650 --> 00:45:36.600
Helen Sneed: And this is. Unfortunately, we

1045
00:45:36.600 --> 00:45:38.560
don't want to do this, but this is sort of

1046
00:45:38.560 --> 00:45:40.400
where we're bringing our topic to an end.

1047
00:45:41.360 --> 00:45:44.160
And, Lisa, thank you for

1048
00:45:44.160 --> 00:45:47.080
your expression of hope and the countless

1049
00:45:47.080 --> 00:45:50.040
ways that you have enlightened us today. It's

1050
00:45:50.040 --> 00:45:52.720
simply. I couldn't count it if I tried.

1051
00:45:52.720 --> 00:45:55.720
And you see, it enriches all of

1052
00:45:55.720 --> 00:45:58.720
us to hear your professional perspective

1053
00:45:58.800 --> 00:46:01.200
and wisdom. And thank you so much for

1054
00:46:01.440 --> 00:46:03.440
being so forthcoming with it today.

1055
00:46:04.250 --> 00:46:06.930
Valerie Milburn: Thank you, my dear friend. Thank you. Thank

1056
00:46:06.930 --> 00:46:07.210
you.

1057
00:46:07.850 --> 00:46:10.250
Speaker A: So happy to be here. I'm happy I could help.

1058
00:46:10.250 --> 00:46:13.050
It's. I like talking about this stuff. I.

1059
00:46:13.210 --> 00:46:14.410
Yeah. Ask my family.

1060
00:46:15.370 --> 00:46:18.370
Helen Sneed: Well, it's endlessly fascinating and. And

1061
00:46:18.370 --> 00:46:21.330
I wish, again, I wish that we had another I

1062
00:46:21.330 --> 00:46:24.250
don't know day. But what we're going to do

1063
00:46:24.250 --> 00:46:27.090
now is what we always do, and that is to

1064
00:46:27.090 --> 00:46:29.730
turn to Valerie for a mindfulness

1065
00:46:29.730 --> 00:46:30.340
exercise.

1066
00:46:31.770 --> 00:46:34.730
Valerie Milburn: Yes. We will close today's episode in our

1067
00:46:34.730 --> 00:46:37.690
traditional way with a mindfulness

1068
00:46:37.690 --> 00:46:40.530
exercise. And what is mindfulness? I always

1069
00:46:40.530 --> 00:46:43.330
give a definition. Mindfulness is a

1070
00:46:43.330 --> 00:46:45.890
mental state achieved by focusing one's

1071
00:46:45.890 --> 00:46:48.730
awareness on the present moment while

1072
00:46:48.730 --> 00:46:51.130
calmly acknowledging and accepting

1073
00:46:51.210 --> 00:46:53.650
one's feelings, thoughts, and

1074
00:46:53.650 --> 00:46:56.620
bodily sensations without judgment.

1075
00:46:56.690 --> 00:46:59.210
Judgment. Today's mindfulness

1076
00:46:59.210 --> 00:47:02.210
exercise introduces a new breathing

1077
00:47:02.210 --> 00:47:05.010
technique. Now here on the Mental Health

1078
00:47:05.010 --> 00:47:07.770
Hope and Recovery podcast, we know the

1079
00:47:07.770 --> 00:47:10.570
importance of our breathing as a part of

1080
00:47:10.570 --> 00:47:13.130
successful meditation and mindfulness

1081
00:47:13.130 --> 00:47:15.930
practices. How we breathe

1082
00:47:15.930 --> 00:47:18.530
influences all sorts of things in our bodies.

1083
00:47:18.770 --> 00:47:21.650
Most significantly, how we breathe

1084
00:47:21.890 --> 00:47:24.880
directly influences our nervous system

1085
00:47:24.950 --> 00:47:27.910
system, which is responsible for how we feel

1086
00:47:28.230 --> 00:47:30.910
and how we interpret the world around

1087
00:47:30.910 --> 00:47:33.550
us. We have started every

1088
00:47:33.550 --> 00:47:36.550
mindfulness exercise since our first episode

1089
00:47:36.550 --> 00:47:39.430
with diaphragmatic breathing. And

1090
00:47:39.430 --> 00:47:42.310
today I'm going to lead us in a new type of

1091
00:47:42.310 --> 00:47:45.190
breathing, the technique of box

1092
00:47:45.430 --> 00:47:47.750
breathing. Now,

1093
00:47:48.150 --> 00:47:50.950
listeners, you know that Helen and I do

1094
00:47:50.950 --> 00:47:53.670
lots of research for each episode. So yes, I

1095
00:47:53.670 --> 00:47:56.640
research box breathing. And

1096
00:47:56.640 --> 00:47:59.200
in my research about box breathing, I learned

1097
00:47:59.200 --> 00:48:02.080
that it is used by U. S. Navy

1098
00:48:02.080 --> 00:48:04.880
SEALs. They use it to help them

1099
00:48:04.880 --> 00:48:07.360
stay calm and alert through any sort of

1100
00:48:07.360 --> 00:48:10.159
situation and they have some

1101
00:48:10.159 --> 00:48:13.000
intense stressful situations. So

1102
00:48:13.000 --> 00:48:15.560
author and former navy seal Mark

1103
00:48:15.560 --> 00:48:18.360
devine says it slows down

1104
00:48:18.360 --> 00:48:20.520
his breathing rate and deepens his

1105
00:48:20.520 --> 00:48:22.960
concentration in all sorts of

1106
00:48:22.960 --> 00:48:25.680
situations. Box breathing

1107
00:48:25.920 --> 00:48:27.960
has also been used as a treatment for

1108
00:48:27.960 --> 00:48:30.600
insomnia because it allows us to calm our

1109
00:48:30.600 --> 00:48:32.880
nervous system at night before bed.

1110
00:48:33.360 --> 00:48:36.200
The mayo clinic reports the benefits

1111
00:48:36.200 --> 00:48:38.960
of box breathing, in addition to the powerful

1112
00:48:38.960 --> 00:48:41.760
benefit of anxiety reduction, include

1113
00:48:41.840 --> 00:48:44.080
pain management and improved mood.

1114
00:48:45.680 --> 00:48:48.680
So what is box breathing? How does it

1115
00:48:48.680 --> 00:48:51.330
work? Box breathing is a

1116
00:48:51.330 --> 00:48:54.170
repetitive breathing pattern of four

1117
00:48:54.330 --> 00:48:57.330
equal length intervals. It

1118
00:48:57.330 --> 00:49:00.170
has a pattern of inhale, hold,

1119
00:49:00.570 --> 00:49:03.490
exhale, hold. An easy

1120
00:49:03.490 --> 00:49:05.329
way to do it is to close your eyes and

1121
00:49:05.329 --> 00:49:08.210
imagine a square. The pattern is to

1122
00:49:08.210 --> 00:49:10.690
breathe in for four seconds as you start from

1123
00:49:10.690 --> 00:49:13.490
the bottom left corner and move vertically

1124
00:49:13.490 --> 00:49:16.260
up the square. Then you hold your breath with

1125
00:49:16.260 --> 00:49:18.700
your lungs inflated for the next four seconds

1126
00:49:18.700 --> 00:49:20.780
as you move to the right at the top of the

1127
00:49:20.780 --> 00:49:23.660
square. From the top right corner, you

1128
00:49:23.660 --> 00:49:26.340
move down the square and exhale for the next

1129
00:49:26.340 --> 00:49:29.340
four seconds. Then finally you move left

1130
00:49:29.340 --> 00:49:31.500
along the bottom of the square as you hold

1131
00:49:31.500 --> 00:49:33.860
your breath with your lungs deflated for the

1132
00:49:33.860 --> 00:49:36.500
final four seconds. So you see, you just

1133
00:49:36.500 --> 00:49:39.140
moved around the square. Your

1134
00:49:39.140 --> 00:49:42.060
lungs are inflating as you move up

1135
00:49:42.060 --> 00:49:44.490
the square, square and deflating as you move

1136
00:49:44.490 --> 00:49:46.610
down the square. And you're holding your

1137
00:49:46.610 --> 00:49:49.490
breath as you move horizontally along the

1138
00:49:49.490 --> 00:49:52.050
top and bottom of the square. Sounds

1139
00:49:52.050 --> 00:49:53.770
confusing, but it's not. We're going to keep

1140
00:49:53.770 --> 00:49:56.650
running through it. So you inhale up,

1141
00:49:57.210 --> 00:49:59.770
hold across, exhale down,

1142
00:50:00.170 --> 00:50:03.090
hold across breathing as you go around

1143
00:50:03.090 --> 00:50:05.850
the square once again before we run through

1144
00:50:05.850 --> 00:50:08.770
it. Inhale up, hold

1145
00:50:08.770 --> 00:50:11.540
across, exhale down, hold

1146
00:50:11.540 --> 00:50:13.980
across. That's how you breathe as you go

1147
00:50:13.980 --> 00:50:16.740
around the square. And remember to breathe

1148
00:50:16.740 --> 00:50:19.660
through your nose and out through your mouth.

1149
00:50:20.380 --> 00:50:22.700
Let's run through it again before we try it.

1150
00:50:22.940 --> 00:50:25.820
Imagine a square inhale

1151
00:50:25.820 --> 00:50:28.100
for four seconds starting at the bottom left

1152
00:50:28.100 --> 00:50:30.940
corner and move up the square.

1153
00:50:31.820 --> 00:50:34.660
Hold your breath with your lungs inflated as

1154
00:50:34.660 --> 00:50:37.470
you move to the right, right from the top

1155
00:50:37.470 --> 00:50:39.390
right, move down,

1156
00:50:40.030 --> 00:50:42.950
exhaling for four seconds. Then you're going

1157
00:50:42.950 --> 00:50:45.590
to move left going along the bottom of the

1158
00:50:45.590 --> 00:50:47.230
square as you hold your breath.

1159
00:50:49.710 --> 00:50:51.790
Okay, let's try it.

1160
00:50:54.270 --> 00:50:57.270
Close your eyes if you can. If you're

1161
00:50:57.270 --> 00:51:00.110
walking or driving, please adapt this

1162
00:51:00.110 --> 00:51:02.680
exercise so that it's safe for your

1163
00:51:02.680 --> 00:51:03.400
surroundings.

1164
00:51:04.920 --> 00:51:06.600
Imagine a square

1165
00:51:07.960 --> 00:51:08.680
inhale.

1166
00:51:11.320 --> 00:51:13.720
Start from the bottom the left corner.

1167
00:51:15.080 --> 00:51:16.360
Go up the square.

1168
00:51:18.520 --> 00:51:20.760
Hold your breath with your lungs inflated.

1169
00:51:21.720 --> 00:51:23.920
Move to the right along the top of the

1170
00:51:23.920 --> 00:51:24.440
square.

1171
00:51:26.680 --> 00:51:29.520
From that right corner, move

1172
00:51:29.520 --> 00:51:31.440
downwards. Exhaling.

1173
00:51:34.400 --> 00:51:36.840
Now move left along the bottom line of the

1174
00:51:36.840 --> 00:51:38.480
square. Holding your breath.

1175
00:51:43.520 --> 00:51:46.480
Let's do it again. Still imagining

1176
00:51:46.480 --> 00:51:49.360
the square. Inhale up the left side

1177
00:51:49.360 --> 00:51:52.120
of the square. Hold your

1178
00:51:52.120 --> 00:51:54.360
breath with your lungs inflated. Moving to

1179
00:51:54.360 --> 00:51:54.790
the right.

1180
00:51:58.140 --> 00:52:00.540
Exhale down the right side of the square.

1181
00:52:02.940 --> 00:52:05.100
Hold your breath with your lungs deflated,

1182
00:52:05.180 --> 00:52:08.060
moving along the left bottom of the square.

1183
00:52:11.020 --> 00:52:12.220
Inhale up.

1184
00:52:15.100 --> 00:52:17.100
Hold your breath going to the right.

1185
00:52:21.510 --> 00:52:22.470
Exhale down.

1186
00:52:26.070 --> 00:52:27.990
Hold your breath going to the left.

1187
00:52:32.390 --> 00:52:33.430
Inhale up.

1188
00:52:38.390 --> 00:52:40.230
Hold your breath going to the right.

1189
00:52:44.870 --> 00:52:45.830
Exhale down.

1190
00:52:48.880 --> 00:52:50.560
Hold your breath going to the left.

1191
00:52:57.120 --> 00:53:00.040
If your eyes are closed, please open

1192
00:53:00.040 --> 00:53:02.119
them and gently bring yourself back to the

1193
00:53:02.119 --> 00:53:02.400
room.

1194
00:53:07.200 --> 00:53:09.840
When you feel anxiety or stress rising in

1195
00:53:09.840 --> 00:53:12.520
your body, remember there are things that can

1196
00:53:12.520 --> 00:53:14.920
be done to calm down those areas of the

1197
00:53:14.920 --> 00:53:17.650
brain. Brain. Try

1198
00:53:17.650 --> 00:53:20.530
picturing the box. Trace the edges.

1199
00:53:21.570 --> 00:53:24.290
Inhale, hold. Exhale,

1200
00:53:24.530 --> 00:53:27.010
hold. Inhale, hold.

1201
00:53:27.570 --> 00:53:30.290
Exhale, hold. Try it. Use it.

1202
00:53:31.009 --> 00:53:33.330
Thank you for doing this mindfulness exercise

1203
00:53:33.330 --> 00:53:33.890
with me.

1204
00:53:35.730 --> 00:53:38.610
Helen Sneed: Well, thank you, Valerie. I worked very hard

1205
00:53:39.410 --> 00:53:41.690
to follow your directions for this because

1206
00:53:41.690 --> 00:53:43.890
it's so refreshing to learn another method of

1207
00:53:43.890 --> 00:53:44.080
breathing.

1208
00:53:44.230 --> 00:53:44.630
Speaker A: Breathing.

1209
00:53:45.110 --> 00:53:47.510
Helen Sneed: I think I have a ways to go, but I've got a

1210
00:53:47.510 --> 00:53:49.950
good start today. And

1211
00:53:49.950 --> 00:53:52.830
Lisa, our deepest gratitude for

1212
00:53:52.830 --> 00:53:55.030
the much needed wisdom and insight that you

1213
00:53:55.030 --> 00:53:57.510
gave us today. Thank you so much.

1214
00:53:58.070 --> 00:54:00.750
And to our listeners, family members around

1215
00:54:00.750 --> 00:54:03.550
the globe, thank you for joining us for the

1216
00:54:03.550 --> 00:54:06.390
family series and for the terrific responses

1217
00:54:06.390 --> 00:54:08.710
we've gotten from our worldwide audiences.

1218
00:54:10.400 --> 00:54:12.960
Our next episode features a brilliant book

1219
00:54:13.200 --> 00:54:16.040
with its co author as our guest. The

1220
00:54:16.040 --> 00:54:18.720
book is called When a Loved One Won't

1221
00:54:18.720 --> 00:54:21.720
Seek Mental Health Treatment. And it deals

1222
00:54:21.720 --> 00:54:23.720
with one of the biggest concerns that Valerie

1223
00:54:23.720 --> 00:54:26.360
and I encounter in our work everywhere. We

1224
00:54:26.360 --> 00:54:28.080
encourage all of you to join us.

1225
00:54:29.200 --> 00:54:31.880
And now I leave you with our favorite

1226
00:54:31.880 --> 00:54:33.680
word, Onward.

1227
00:54:39.040 --> 00:54:44.200
Valerie Milburn: Sam.